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Post by ])-Kyle "Wild Child" Gibney-([ on May 1, 2024 22:03:30 GMT 1
At the risk of leaning into bad-faith territory, an idea occurs to me. I'm not swearing by it yet so hold the tar and feathering, but I wonder sometimes about a Star Trek spinoff about Dax. They can go just about anywhere and be a one-person army because they already kind of are. Dax gone rogue could be cool.
No idea who that is unfortunately. However, it does remind me of that Rick and Morty episode where a planet was a person at the same time lol. She could also appear as a "person"
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Post by ])-Kyle "Wild Child" Gibney-([ on May 1, 2024 22:07:31 GMT 1
Yeah I only called him Benny as I didnt want to write the whole name, quite a mouthful lol. However, I have heard of Eggs Benny-maybe I got it from there? I do like abbreviating things at times though Amy and Rory were awesome. Then Matt Smith disappeared pretty much at the same time right? It's like who's this old dude that we got now? Im sure he's a fine actor but that was just too much change for me. Ive seen the first few episodes of Torchwood and it didnt take so I didnt bother with the rest. May revisit it now since you said it gets better. Moreover, I didnt know the title was an anagram until now-pretty cool trivia Peter Capaldi got off to a rocky start. The 2nd season in my opinion is where he found his stride. His second season (which I think is season 9) is one of my favourite seasons for just being fun. It's almost all 2-part episodes too with several mystery type episodes.
I'm not the biggest fan of Doctor/companion tension, and there was a lot of it between the Doctor and Clara in his Capaldi's firsrt season. I liked Tenant and Rose' chemistry because I liked their partners-in-crime vibe, but the connection between the Doctor and Amy was really deep too.
I'm actually displeased with whatever exclusivity deal Doctor Who, or rather the BBC, has with Disney +. I feel like it takes Doctor Who further away from its North American audience. One of my best friends can't watch it. Him -> Yeah Tennant was great. Shout out to Eccleston too though. So annoying that he left so soon
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Post by ])-Kyle "Wild Child" Gibney-([ on May 1, 2024 22:09:08 GMT 1
Interestingly I've found myself really applauding how unique I've found quite a bit of new cinema. The last several years has not gone without quite a few very non-traditional films. That's what I mean--not traditional western narrative film.
Everyone goes "but Asia!"
Yeah..we aren't in Asia and film originated in Europe--so there's a problem Houston.
There's Dune. The way it was done was relatively new and innovative
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Post by AQUA CAT! on May 1, 2024 22:52:55 GMT 1
Peter Capaldi got off to a rocky start. The 2nd season in my opinion is where he found his stride. His second season (which I think is season 9) is one of my favourite seasons for just being fun. It's almost all 2-part episodes too with several mystery type episodes.
I'm not the biggest fan of Doctor/companion tension, and there was a lot of it between the Doctor and Clara in his Capaldi's firsrt season. I liked Tenant and Rose' chemistry because I liked their partners-in-crime vibe, but the connection between the Doctor and Amy was really deep too.
I'm actually displeased with whatever exclusivity deal Doctor Who, or rather the BBC, has with Disney +. I feel like it takes Doctor Who further away from its North American audience. One of my best friends can't watch it. Him -> Yeah Tennant was great. Shout out to Eccleston too though. So annoying that he left so soon I adored Eccleston. Totally agreed. I got the impression he wasn't thrilled to leave either. Not that he was fired or anything, but that it was just the plan to have him for a season and move on, and by the BBC's terms it worked out great, but not Eccleston's.
With that in mind, this is my 3rd future ex-wife after Amelia Pond and Shakira:
Meet Jadzia Dax. Jadzia is her name. Dax is the name of the alien symbiote called the Trill that lives inside her.
She's from Deep Space 9, and she's not entirely unlike Doctor Who in the sense that she can be recast as anybody male or female, or any species. Trills are aliens with long lifespans and extraordinary capabilities, but they need host bodies, so people from all over the galaxy apply to have Trill surgically implanted in them. Only the elite of the elite are chosen to be joined with Trill, and all people who're joined with Trill get those tattoo markings to identify themselves. They live for centuries, so whenever they inhabit a new body, they have all the memories of their past lives with them just like Doctor Who. New body, same person.
Nice. Haven't seen that Rick and Morty episode but Ego from GOTG2 is like that if I understand correctly.
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Post by Chalice_Of_Evil on May 1, 2024 23:43:30 GMT 1
Road House (2024) lost me for a bit in the middle but my attention snapped back when one of the baddies was giving a speech in the bar. "Suffering" is strong. I didn't mean it to sound that assertive. I liked the new Road House. I just didn't really get why it was called Road House. They're so different. Off the top of my head I don't recall any nods to the original except for the name of the bar. I liked the first one more ultimately because it was campy, but like fist and bar-fighting campy. The newer one was kind of drab. The bar in the first one was thriving and the bar in the second one seemed like it was dying.
Star Wars. Star Trek. When will they all learn to get along and accept defeat from Doctor Who? Just kidding. Star Trek and Star Wars are like DC and Marvel. Which one scratches the itch depends on the time of day. I'm more of a Star Wars fan because I prefer their highs to Star Trek's highs. I like Star Trek now but it's a much more recent addition to my life. Star Trek (2009) is solid though. Loved watching Kirk get some shots in at the bar fight. Karl Urban as Bones was great. I'm aware of the same criticisms of Abrams but if it works it works. It took a while for Into Darkness to grow on me because it borrowed so much, but it grew on me with age.
You know what I liked as a reboot? The Benedict Cumberbatch Sherlock Holmes. I thought he fit surprisingly well into the 2010's. I would love to see the Wicked, the origin story of the Witch from The Wizard of Oz. I thought Maleficent and Cruella were on the right track too for doing something different.
Benny was awesome as the modern day Sherlock. Similarly the actors that played Moriarty, Irene, Watson and Mycroft. Too bad UK shows dont last as long Have you heard of the Sherlock Holmes that lives in the States by way of the series entitled Elementary? Not as good but still pretty decent. Lucy Liu becomes Joan Watson as his sober companion There's a certain kind of smugness that came from being fond of the BBC's Sherlock before others realised how good it was an it became popular. I know when it was first announced, people were up in arms about Sherlock Holmes and Watson being set in the 'modern era', while I was intrigued. The first two seasons were great. I really didn't like the third season myself, and unlike most I actually didn't mind the fourth/final season (I hated that 'Abominable Bride Special' that was set between Seasons 3 & 4). Unpopular opinion: Andrew Scott annoyed the shit out of me as Moriarty, with that stupid voice he was putting on. He was basically doing a more sadistic version of The Master from the Russell. T. Davies era of Doctor Who and I thought he was overpraised by people. The best thing his character ever did in the show was in the Season 2 final, which made him FINALLY SHUT UP. Personally, I much-preferred the iteration of Moriarty in the TV series Elementary (won't post spoilers here in case AQUA CAT! decides to check it out). Just like people were pissed about a 'modern' Sherlock, they seemed equally pissed at an American version of the BBC series. I gave it a chance, and thought it was quite good (though Season 1 was probably the 'best' imho, and that's due in large part to who was cast as Moriarty). I did think they dragged the show out too long, though. It kinda had the perfect ending with the second-to-last season final. It really didn't need that final season. Yeah, like DC/Marvel I enjoy both. Sometimes it's just fun to pick on DC though, and it doesnt help that they make it so easy with the general lower quality of their film slate lol. Further, yes you are quite right. If it works, it works with that particular Trek film. Doctor Who is good-only watched the new version and until both Amy and Rory left the series. Benny was awesome as the modern day Sherlock. Similarly the actors that played Moriarty, Irene, Watson and Mycroft. Too bad UK shows dont last as long Have you heard of the Sherlock Holmes that lives in the States by way of the series entitled Elementary? Not as good but still pretty decent. Lucy Liu becomes Joan Watson as his sober companion Oh Amy and Rory. How I missed them.
I haven't yet. I would though, re Elementary. The ads look good. It would certainly be interesting seeing Sherlock fit into America. I've always thought he and Doctor Who were devised to be quintessentially British. I liked all the actors in the Benny (calling it that now) Sherlock. I liked the Irene Adler episode a lot and I thought the actress nailed it.
Oh Amy and Rory. How I missed them. I've you've never seen it, Torchwood (an anagram of Doctor Who) was pretty decent as a spin-off. It didn't last too long; 4 seasons, the latter two being single stories. If you don't know if then the center of the spin-off is Captain Jack heading up his own alien-intelligence unit. The final season, one long 10-parter, was very ambitious and I'm not sure it stuck the landing, and the first season had some growing pains, but the second and third season I recall being solid.
Yeah I only called him Benny as I didnt want to write the whole name, quite a mouthful lol. However, I have heard of Eggs Benny-maybe I got it from there? I do like abbreviating things at times though Amy and Rory were awesome. Then Matt Smith disappeared pretty much at the same time right? It's like who's this old dude that we got now? Im sure he's a fine actor but that was just too much change for me. Ive seen the first few episodes of Torchwood and it didnt take so I didnt bother with the rest. May revisit it now since you said it gets better. Moreover, I didnt know the title was an anagram until now-pretty cool trivia The Matt Smith era with The Doctor/Amy/Rory is my favourite era of 'NuWho' (which is what I've seen people call the show from 2005, when it was brought back, onwards). Yeah I only called him Benny as I didnt want to write the whole name, quite a mouthful lol. However, I have heard of Eggs Benny-maybe I got it from there? I do like abbreviating things at times though Amy and Rory were awesome. Then Matt Smith disappeared pretty much at the same time right? It's like who's this old dude that we got now? Im sure he's a fine actor but that was just too much change for me. Ive seen the first few episodes of Torchwood and it didnt take so I didnt bother with the rest. May revisit it now since you said it gets better. Moreover, I didnt know the title was an anagram until now-pretty cool trivia Peter Capaldi got off to a rocky start. The 2nd season in my opinion is where he found his stride. His second season (which I think is season 9) is one of my favourite seasons for just being fun. It's almost all 2-part episodes too with several mystery type episodes. I'm not the biggest fan of Doctor/companion tension, and there was a lot of it between the Doctor and Clara in his Capaldi's firsrt season. I liked Tenant and Rose' chemistry because I liked their partners-in-crime vibe, but the connection between the Doctor and Amy was really deep too. I'm actually displeased with whatever exclusivity deal Doctor Who, or rather the BBC, has with Disney +. I feel like it takes Doctor Who further away from its North American audience. One of my best friends can't watch it. Him -> Hallelujah! Someone else who didn't think Capaldi was 'all that'. He was easily my least favourite Doctor of 'NuWho' and I almost stopped watching during Season 10, I found it so intolerable (the only season I've fast-forwarded through eps of). Unlike most, I didn't hate the Jodie Whittaker seasons. I even review them here, if you're interested (though, obviously they inlcude spoilers): sakaar.freeforums.net/thread/728/doctor-who-thread?page=2Yeah Tennant was great. Shout out to Eccleston too though. So annoying that he left so soon Tennant used to be my fave Doctor, but over time my enjoyment of him has somewhat faded and Matt Smith became my fave. As for Eccleston, he did not leave on good terms. I watched a YouTube vid a while abck where he mentions what it'd take to get him back on the show... The whole thing is worth watching in you get the time: And I'm in the same boat as your friend regarding no longer being able to watch DW, AQUA CAT! (since I don't do streaming, everything after Jodie Whittaker's last episode has been on Disney+ ands therefore I've missed out seeing it). Disney can go hang for all I care, as this is a massive F.U. to the ABC here which has aired DW since it first began back in the 60's and now no longer can because D+ is holding it hostage.
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Post by AQUA CAT! on May 2, 2024 17:16:01 GMT 1
Benny was awesome as the modern day Sherlock. Similarly the actors that played Moriarty, Irene, Watson and Mycroft. Too bad UK shows dont last as long Have you heard of the Sherlock Holmes that lives in the States by way of the series entitled Elementary? Not as good but still pretty decent. Lucy Liu becomes Joan Watson as his sober companion There's a certain kind of smugness that came from being fond of the BBC's Sherlock before others realised how good it was an it became popular. I know when it was first announced, people were up in arms about Sherlock Holmes and Watson being set in the 'modern era', while I was intrigued. The first two seasons were great. I really didn't like the third season myself, and unlike most I actually didn't mind the fourth/final season (I hated that 'Abominable Bride Special' that was set between Seasons 3 & 4). Unpopular opinion: Andrew Scott annoyed the shit out of me as Moriarty, with that stupid voice he was putting on. He was basically doing a more sadistic version of The Master from the Russell. T. Davies era of Doctor Who and I thought he was overpraised by people. The best thing his character ever did in the show was in the Season 2 final, which made him FINALLY SHUT UP. Personally, I much-preferred the iteration of Moriarty in the TV series Elementary (won't post spoilers here in case AQUA CAT! decides to check it out). Just like people were pissed about a 'modern' Sherlock, they seemed equally pissed at an American version of the BBC series. I gave it a chance, and thought it was quite good (though Season 1 was probably the 'best' imho, and that's due in large part to who was cast as Moriarty). I did think they dragged the show out too long, though. It kinda had the perfect ending with the second-to-last season final. It really didn't need that final season. Oh Amy and Rory. How I missed them.
Yeah I only called him Benny as I didnt want to write the whole name, quite a mouthful lol. However, I have heard of Eggs Benny-maybe I got it from there? I do like abbreviating things at times though Amy and Rory were awesome. Then Matt Smith disappeared pretty much at the same time right? It's like who's this old dude that we got now? Im sure he's a fine actor but that was just too much change for me. Ive seen the first few episodes of Torchwood and it didnt take so I didnt bother with the rest. May revisit it now since you said it gets better. Moreover, I didnt know the title was an anagram until now-pretty cool trivia The Matt Smith era with The Doctor/Amy/Rory is my favourite era of 'NuWho' (which is what I've seen people call the show from 2005, when it was brought back, onwards). Peter Capaldi got off to a rocky start. The 2nd season in my opinion is where he found his stride. His second season (which I think is season 9) is one of my favourite seasons for just being fun. It's almost all 2-part episodes too with several mystery type episodes. I'm not the biggest fan of Doctor/companion tension, and there was a lot of it between the Doctor and Clara in his Capaldi's firsrt season. I liked Tenant and Rose' chemistry because I liked their partners-in-crime vibe, but the connection between the Doctor and Amy was really deep too. I'm actually displeased with whatever exclusivity deal Doctor Who, or rather the BBC, has with Disney +. I feel like it takes Doctor Who further away from its North American audience. One of my best friends can't watch it. Him -> Hallelujah! Someone else who didn't think Capaldi was 'all that'. He was easily my least favourite Doctor of 'NuWho' and I almost stopped watching during Season 10, I found it so intolerable (the only season I've fast-forwarded through eps of). Unlike most, I didn't hate the Jodie Whittaker seasons. I even review them here, if you're interested (though, obviously they inlcude spoilers): sakaar.freeforums.net/thread/728/doctor-who-thread?page=2Yeah Tennant was great. Shout out to Eccleston too though. So annoying that he left so soon Tennant used to be my fave Doctor, but over time my enjoyment of him has somewhat faded and Matt Smith became my fave. As for Eccleston, he did not leave on good terms. I watched a YouTube vid a while abck where he mentions what it'd take to get him back on the show... The whole thing is worth watching in you get the time: And I'm in the same boat as your friend regarding no longer being able to watch DW, AQUA CAT! (since I don't do streaming, everything after Jodie Whittaker's last episode has been on Disney+ ands therefore I've missed out seeing it). Disney can go hang for all I care, as this is a massive F.U. to the ABC here which has aired DW since it first began back in the 60's and now no longer can because D+ is holding it hostage. Yeah I'm quite underwhelmed at this deal taking Doctor Who out of public circulation. There's 4 episodes: 3 with Tenant and 1 introducing the new Doctor, and I don't even feel good watching them because my friend can't watch along.
I'll check out that review thread. I can't remember if I forgot there was a Doctor Who thread or if I never knew, but either way, awesome!
I'd have to watch it again to see if there was more logic to it than I recall, but it threw me when Moriarty killed himself in the Benny Sherlock. It just seemed so sudden, like a snap decision that preemptively took him out of the running. I kept expecting the series to loop back to him being alive somehow because, at the time, I just could not grasp the strategy. I recall at the time understanding it, but it seemed to me if he thought about it for more than 2 seconds he'd have figured something else out. If part of the goal was to baffle Sherlock then it worked, but he wasn't the only one. It felt to me like the show took some wind out of its own sails by killing off Sherlock's most famous adversary so soon. Then again, maybe it didn't anticipate continuing on.
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Post by Chalice_Of_Evil on May 2, 2024 22:39:29 GMT 1
I'd have to watch it again to see if there was more logic to it than I recall, but it threw me when Moriarty killed himself in the Benny Sherlock. It just seemed so sudden, like a snap decision that preemptively took him out of the running. I kept expecting the series to loop back to him being alive somehow because, at the time, I just could not grasp the strategy. I recall at the time understanding it, but it seemed to me if he thought about it for more than 2 seconds he'd have figured something else out. If part of the goal was to baffle Sherlock then it worked, but he wasn't the only one. It felt to me like the show took some wind out of its own sails by killing off Sherlock's most famous adversary so soon. Then again, maybe it didn't anticipate continuing on.
That's precisely why I LOVE that moment and think it's the best thing that version of Moriarty ever did - precisely because it wasn't planned, he made the decision in the *moment* because he knew it'd royally screw Sherlock. SO many bad guys in things like to talk big, making out they're prepared to die for their cause (the ol' slow-walk-towards-gun-aimed-at-them-and-press-it-against-their-own-forhead trick never feels like it has any tension for me because I *know* the good guy isn't going to pull the trigger). This is the only instance I can think of where a villain has had a plan sorted out, then changed his mind - including willingly killing himself - just to stick it to the hero (most villains won't do this because they want to stick around to enjoying continually tormenting the hero). It's one of the most ballsy things I've seen done with a villain (and I won't lie, I personally was glad to be rid of that annoying-voiced Moriarty. Unfortunately, Season 3's Big Bad was terribly lacklustre and it's clear that were overcompensating for a lack of decent villain by just making that one plain gross - the fact lick, ick!). I'm glad they never undid Moriarty's demise, as that would've been a true 'jump-the-shark' moment. Anyway, I think more shows/movies should have villains who've got the guts to off themselves just to mess with the heroes.
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Post by AQUA CAT! on May 3, 2024 0:29:58 GMT 1
I'd have to watch it again to see if there was more logic to it than I recall, but it threw me when Moriarty killed himself in the Benny Sherlock. It just seemed so sudden, like a snap decision that preemptively took him out of the running. I kept expecting the series to loop back to him being alive somehow because, at the time, I just could not grasp the strategy. I recall at the time understanding it, but it seemed to me if he thought about it for more than 2 seconds he'd have figured something else out. If part of the goal was to baffle Sherlock then it worked, but he wasn't the only one. It felt to me like the show took some wind out of its own sails by killing off Sherlock's most famous adversary so soon. Then again, maybe it didn't anticipate continuing on.
That's precisely why I LOVE that moment and think it's the best thing that version of Moriarty ever did - precisely because it wasn't planned, he made the decision in the *moment* because he knew it'd royally screw Sherlock. SO many bad guys in things like to talk big, making out they're prepared to die for their cause (the ol' slow-walk-towards-gun-aimed-at-them-and-press-it-against-their-own-forhead trick never feels like it has any tension for me because I *know* the good guy isn't going to pull the trigger). This is the only instance I can think of where a villain has had a plan sorted out, then changed his mind - including willingly killing himself - just to stick it to the hero (most villains won't do this because they want to stick around to enjoying continually tormenting the hero). It's one of the most ballsy things I've seen done with a villain (and I won't lie, I personally was glad to be rid of that annoying-voiced Moriarty. Unfortunately, Season 3's Big Bad was terribly lacklustre and it's clear that were overcompensating for a lack of decent villain by just making that one plain gross - the fact lick, ick!). I'm glad they never undid Moriarty's demise, as that would've been a true 'jump-the-shark' moment. Anyway, I think more shows/movies should have villains who've got the guts to off themselves just to mess with the heroes. That's definitely an interesting take. I don't recall if Moriarty knew or saw something that only he could vouch for that would save or help Sherlock, but it certainly puts Sherlock in a bind. At the time it seemed like a remarkable tradeoff. The one life our best science says you have forfeited for a tactical advantage over an opponent? It's certainly gusty. Sherlock's reaction, which I do remember, rather suggests even he was shocked. Perhaps this was a gift in passing from Moriarty; to have rattled Sherlock with a plan he did not see coming, and preemptively rob Sherlock of evening the score. I gotta say it's a pretty cool gambit gambling with your life like that. It would be pretty interesting to see more villains incorporate that into their plan. I don't recall any similar deaths that happened so suddenly, but I vaguely, vaguely recall a situation where a villain's goal was to have themselves killed (or marked for death) by the end. It's on the tip of my brain. Damn. I'll be up all night trying to remember it now, but I recall thinking it was just diabolical.
For season 3 are you talking about the Baron of something whose talent was blackmailing everyone? I wasn't a fan of him either. I thought you had meant for a second Mycroft whose role in the Victorian Era special was a homebody shut-in whose goals in life were being fat and right, but I also misread "the fact lick, ick!" as "the fat lick, ick". I read above you didn't care much for it. I didn't either. I liked the concept at first but it didn't quite get there for me. It struck me while watching that it was an interesting departure for Sherlock until I clued back in that this is normal Sherlock and the modern era London Sherlock is the departure.
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Post by primemcgee on May 3, 2024 2:31:46 GMT 1
There's Dune. The way it was done was relatively new and innovative I was referring to non-sequels and remakes. Usually when you say "there are lots of new things..." it is always Asia. No one ever says "you know I saw really good low-budget action film made in Des Moines..it reminded me of Charles Pierce films of the 70s."
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Post by Chalice_Of_Evil on May 3, 2024 3:23:17 GMT 1
That's precisely why I LOVE that moment and think it's the best thing that version of Moriarty ever did - precisely because it wasn't planned, he made the decision in the *moment* because he knew it'd royally screw Sherlock. SO many bad guys in things like to talk big, making out they're prepared to die for their cause (the ol' slow-walk-towards-gun-aimed-at-them-and-press-it-against-their-own-forhead trick never feels like it has any tension for me because I *know* the good guy isn't going to pull the trigger). This is the only instance I can think of where a villain has had a plan sorted out, then changed his mind - including willingly killing himself - just to stick it to the hero (most villains won't do this because they want to stick around to enjoying continually tormenting the hero). It's one of the most ballsy things I've seen done with a villain (and I won't lie, I personally was glad to be rid of that annoying-voiced Moriarty. Unfortunately, Season 3's Big Bad was terribly lacklustre and it's clear that were overcompensating for a lack of decent villain by just making that one plain gross - the fact lick, ick!). I'm glad they never undid Moriarty's demise, as that would've been a true 'jump-the-shark' moment. Anyway, I think more shows/movies should have villains who've got the guts to off themselves just to mess with the heroes. That's definitely an interesting take. I don't recall if Moriarty knew or saw something that only he could vouch for that would save or help Sherlock, but it certainly puts Sherlock in a bind. At the time it seemed like a remarkable tradeoff. The one life our best science says you have forfeited for a tactical advantage over an opponent? It's certainly gusty. Sherlock's reaction, which I do remember, rather suggests even he was shocked. Perhaps this was a gift in passing from Moriarty; to have rattled Sherlock with a plan he did not see coming, and preemptively rob Sherlock of evening the score. I gotta say it's a pretty cool gambit gambling with your life like that. It would be pretty interesting to see more villains incorporate that into their plan. I don't recall any similar deaths that happened so suddenly, but I vaguely, vaguely recall a situation where a villain's goal was to have themselves killed (or marked for death) by the end. It's on the tip of my brain. Damn. I'll be up all night trying to remember it now, but I recall thinking it was just diabolical. For season 3 are you talking about the Baron of something whose talent was blackmailing everyone? I wasn't a fan of him either. I thought you had meant for a second Mycroft whose role in the Victorian Era special was a homebody shut-in whose goals in life were being fat and right, but I also misread "the fact lick, ick!" as "the fat lick, ick". I read above you didn't care much for it. I didn't either. I liked the concept at first but it didn't quite get there for me. It struck me while watching that it was an interesting departure for Sherlock until I clued back in that this is normal Sherlock and the modern era London Sherlock is the departure.
I'd meant 'that face lick, ick!' (the Season 3 final bad guy licks a woman's face at one point). It just seemed to me like they needed this bad guy to be different to Moriarty, so instead of being 'wacky' they just had him be creepy/gross. The thing that bugged me the most was him doing his own version of Sherlock's 'Mind Palace' and we see him literally flicking through imaginary files in a filing cabinet or whatever - it was just too literal for my taste. I much preferred Sherlock's version. Sorry I'm addressing your points in reverse, but as for Moriarty - I can't recall the details, but I thought at least part of the reason why he offed himself was so he couldn't be tortured/forced into giving any info that would help Sherlock or stop the men he had in place ready to kill Sherlock's friends if he didn't do what Moriarty wanted. As long as your alive, there *are* things that could be done to get stuff out of you, but if you're dead...there's NO way to - that's what I thought was the reason for such a drastic action. I also liked that he just came up with it on the fly, like he probably would've enjoyed watching Sherlock jump off that building, but instead he readjusted and went with what he deemed necessary in the moment - which was to remove himself entirely. I just thought this wasn't a move I'd seen from a villain before. Usually if they end up offing themselves, they plan ahead, whereas this seemed like an in-the-moment decision.
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Post by AQUA CAT! on May 3, 2024 16:42:03 GMT 1
That's definitely an interesting take. I don't recall if Moriarty knew or saw something that only he could vouch for that would save or help Sherlock, but it certainly puts Sherlock in a bind. At the time it seemed like a remarkable tradeoff. The one life our best science says you have forfeited for a tactical advantage over an opponent? It's certainly gusty. Sherlock's reaction, which I do remember, rather suggests even he was shocked. Perhaps this was a gift in passing from Moriarty; to have rattled Sherlock with a plan he did not see coming, and preemptively rob Sherlock of evening the score. I gotta say it's a pretty cool gambit gambling with your life like that. It would be pretty interesting to see more villains incorporate that into their plan. I don't recall any similar deaths that happened so suddenly, but I vaguely, vaguely recall a situation where a villain's goal was to have themselves killed (or marked for death) by the end. It's on the tip of my brain. Damn. I'll be up all night trying to remember it now, but I recall thinking it was just diabolical. For season 3 are you talking about the Baron of something whose talent was blackmailing everyone? I wasn't a fan of him either. I thought you had meant for a second Mycroft whose role in the Victorian Era special was a homebody shut-in whose goals in life were being fat and right, but I also misread "the fact lick, ick!" as "the fat lick, ick". I read above you didn't care much for it. I didn't either. I liked the concept at first but it didn't quite get there for me. It struck me while watching that it was an interesting departure for Sherlock until I clued back in that this is normal Sherlock and the modern era London Sherlock is the departure.
I'd meant 'that face lick, ick!' (the Season 3 final bad guy licks a woman's face at one point). It just seemed to me like they needed this bad guy to be different to Moriarty, so instead of being 'wacky' they just had him be creepy/gross. The thing that bugged me the most was him doing his own version of Sherlock's 'Mind Palace' and we see him literally flicking through imaginary files in a filing cabinet or whatever - it was just too literal for my taste. I much preferred Sherlock's version. Sorry I'm addressing your points in reverse, but as for Moriarty - I can't recall the details, but I thought at least part of the reason why he offed himself was so he couldn't be tortured/forced into giving any info that would help Sherlock or stop the men he had in place ready to kill Sherlock's friends if he didn't do what Moriarty wanted. As long as your alive, there *are* things that could be done to get stuff out of you, but if you're dead...there's NO way to - that's what I thought was the reason for such a drastic action. I also liked that he just came up with it on the fly, like he probably would've enjoyed watching Sherlock jump off that building, but instead he readjusted and went with what he deemed necessary in the moment - which was to remove himself entirely. I just thought this wasn't a move I'd seen from a villain before. Usually if they end up offing themselves, they plan ahead, whereas this seemed like an in-the-moment decision. Typos are mutually annoying. I don't like the typos but the typos like me.
I recall the details even less but it's coming back to me as you explain it. I'd still need to watch it again to be sure, but it vaguely rings a bell that Moriarty can't be compelled or coerced to call off the hits if he's too dead to do it. There was a moment in season 4 (I think) where Moriarty showed up and my first reaction was "so he's not dead!", but then the caption revealed this to be several years ago and I was like "oh".
I remember what this reminds me of. It wasn't an intentional death or suicide, but it was a gang leader... actually I'll start from earlier. It was a Chinese movie where, in order to escape from a heist, the leader of the gang shot himself in the head to be taken to ER and organize his rescue from the hospital.
I remember Baron what's his face licking that woman's face too, and his poor man's mind palace. If I recall, Sherlock shot him. It probably came as a great shock to him that his death wasn't more grandiose and befitting of his ego.
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Post by ])-Kyle "Wild Child" Gibney-([ on May 3, 2024 22:52:15 GMT 1
There's Dune. The way it was done was relatively new and innovative I was referring to non-sequels and remakes. Usually when you say "there are lots of new things..." it is always Asia. No one ever says "you know I saw really good low-budget action film made in Des Moines..it reminded me of Charles Pierce films of the 70s."
Ok but Dune is a remake. There was the other one with Kyle whatshisface-the guy from Twin Peaks
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Post by Chalice_Of_Evil on May 4, 2024 0:00:40 GMT 1
I'd meant 'that face lick, ick!' (the Season 3 final bad guy licks a woman's face at one point). It just seemed to me like they needed this bad guy to be different to Moriarty, so instead of being 'wacky' they just had him be creepy/gross. The thing that bugged me the most was him doing his own version of Sherlock's 'Mind Palace' and we see him literally flicking through imaginary files in a filing cabinet or whatever - it was just too literal for my taste. I much preferred Sherlock's version. Sorry I'm addressing your points in reverse, but as for Moriarty - I can't recall the details, but I thought at least part of the reason why he offed himself was so he couldn't be tortured/forced into giving any info that would help Sherlock or stop the men he had in place ready to kill Sherlock's friends if he didn't do what Moriarty wanted. As long as your alive, there *are* things that could be done to get stuff out of you, but if you're dead...there's NO way to - that's what I thought was the reason for such a drastic action. I also liked that he just came up with it on the fly, like he probably would've enjoyed watching Sherlock jump off that building, but instead he readjusted and went with what he deemed necessary in the moment - which was to remove himself entirely. I just thought this wasn't a move I'd seen from a villain before. Usually if they end up offing themselves, they plan ahead, whereas this seemed like an in-the-moment decision. Typos are mutually annoying. I don't like the typos but the typos like me. I recall the details even less but it's coming back to me as you explain it. I'd still need to watch it again to be sure, but it vaguely rings a bell that Moriarty can't be compelled or coerced to call off the hits if he's too dead to do it. There was a moment in season 4 (I think) where Moriarty showed up and my first reaction was "so he's not dead!", but then the caption revealed this to be several years ago and I was like "oh". I remember what this reminds me of. It wasn't an intentional death or suicide, but it was a gang leader... actually I'll start from earlier. It was a Chinese movie where, in order to escape from a heist, the leader of the gang shot himself in the head to be taken to ER and organize his rescue from the hospital. I remember Baron what's his face licking that woman's face too, and his poor man's mind palace. If I recall, Sherlock shot him. It probably came as a great shock to him that his death wasn't more grandiose and befitting of his ego.
That was SUCH a satisfying death for a villain who I hated. I wish more characters would just plug the villain either when they're mid-speechifying/at their most confident.
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Post by ])-Kyle "Wild Child" Gibney-([ on May 4, 2024 23:24:40 GMT 1
Benny was awesome as the modern day Sherlock. Similarly the actors that played Moriarty, Irene, Watson and Mycroft. Too bad UK shows dont last as long Have you heard of the Sherlock Holmes that lives in the States by way of the series entitled Elementary? Not as good but still pretty decent. Lucy Liu becomes Joan Watson as his sober companion There's a certain kind of smugness that came from being fond of the BBC's Sherlock before others realised how good it was an it became popular. I know when it was first announced, people were up in arms about Sherlock Holmes and Watson being set in the 'modern era', while I was intrigued. The first two seasons were great. I really didn't like the third season myself, and unlike most I actually didn't mind the fourth/final season (I hated that 'Abominable Bride Special' that was set between Seasons 3 & 4). Unpopular opinion: Andrew Scott annoyed the shit out of me as Moriarty, with that stupid voice he was putting on. He was basically doing a more sadistic version of The Master from the Russell. T. Davies era of Doctor Who and I thought he was overpraised by people. The best thing his character ever did in the show was in the Season 2 final, which made him FINALLY SHUT UP. Personally, I much-preferred the iteration of Moriarty in the TV series Elementary (won't post spoilers here in case AQUA CAT! decides to check it out). Just like people were pissed about a 'modern' Sherlock, they seemed equally pissed at an American version of the BBC series. I gave it a chance, and thought it was quite good (though Season 1 was probably the 'best' imho, and that's due in large part to who was cast as Moriarty). I did think they dragged the show out too long, though. It kinda had the perfect ending with the second-to-last season final. It really didn't need that final season. Yeah Tennant was great. Shout out to Eccleston too though. So annoying that he left so soon Tennant used to be my fave Doctor, but over time my enjoyment of him has somewhat faded and Matt Smith became my fave. As for Eccleston, he did not leave on good terms. I watched a YouTube vid a while abck where he mentions what it'd take to get him back on the show... And I'm in the same boat as your friend regarding no longer being able to watch DW, AQUA CAT! (since I don't do streaming, everything after Jodie Whittaker's last episode has been on Disney+ ands therefore I've missed out seeing it). Disney can go hang for all I care, as this is a massive F.U. to the ABC here which has aired DW since it first began back in the 60's and now no longer can because D+ is holding it hostage. I personally enjoyed both Moriartys. Scott is a fantastic actor. He was really good in 1917 as well. As for the other one, it was an interesting take and it worked-this is how certain characters should be written and not be in service of political messages. Im going to stay vague here in case others decide to pick the series up and watch it lol Thats a shame with Eccleston. Unfortunately, workplace politics exists everywhere and it is annoying for sure but it's best to stay out of it unless you have the right backing, even then it's risky for obvious reasons. He's honest though, even mentioned his own pride. Credit where credit is due
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Post by ])-Kyle "Wild Child" Gibney-([ on May 4, 2024 23:36:12 GMT 1
I'd have to watch it again to see if there was more logic to it than I recall, but it threw me when Moriarty killed himself in the Benny Sherlock. It just seemed so sudden, like a snap decision that preemptively took him out of the running. I kept expecting the series to loop back to him being alive somehow because, at the time, I just could not grasp the strategy. I recall at the time understanding it, but it seemed to me if he thought about it for more than 2 seconds he'd have figured something else out. If part of the goal was to baffle Sherlock then it worked, but he wasn't the only one. It felt to me like the show took some wind out of its own sails by killing off Sherlock's most famous adversary so soon. Then again, maybe it didn't anticipate continuing on.
That's precisely why I LOVE that moment and think it's the best thing that version of Moriarty ever did - precisely because it wasn't planned, he made the decision in the *moment* because he knew it'd royally screw Sherlock. SO many bad guys in things like to talk big, making out they're prepared to die for their cause (the ol' slow-walk-towards-gun-aimed-at-them-and-press-it-against-their-own-forhead trick never feels like it has any tension for me because I *know* the good guy isn't going to pull the trigger). This is the only instance I can think of where a villain has had a plan sorted out, then changed his mind - including willingly killing himself - just to stick it to the hero (most villains won't do this because they want to stick around to enjoying continually tormenting the hero). It's one of the most ballsy things I've seen done with a villain (and I won't lie, I personally was glad to be rid of that annoying-voiced Moriarty. Unfortunately, Season 3's Big Bad was terribly lacklustre and it's clear that were overcompensating for a lack of decent villain by just making that one plain gross - the fact lick, ick!). I'm glad they never undid Moriarty's demise, as that would've been a true 'jump-the-shark' moment. Anyway, I think more shows/movies should have villains who've got the guts to off themselves just to mess with the heroes. AQUA CAT!I have to agree with Cat here too. Thought it was odd the way Moriarty was done. However, that is an interesting perspective. How often does the villain actually do that? Speaking of other "villain" plans/endings, I would be remiss by not mentioning Watchmen's (movie, not the HBO series) ending. Thought it was such a baller move when Ozymandias said that the plan was already in motion some minutes before..it's like oh shit..too late mofos muahaha
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Post by AQUA CAT! on May 5, 2024 0:23:27 GMT 1
Typos are mutually annoying. I don't like the typos but the typos like me. I recall the details even less but it's coming back to me as you explain it. I'd still need to watch it again to be sure, but it vaguely rings a bell that Moriarty can't be compelled or coerced to call off the hits if he's too dead to do it. There was a moment in season 4 (I think) where Moriarty showed up and my first reaction was "so he's not dead!", but then the caption revealed this to be several years ago and I was like "oh". I remember what this reminds me of. It wasn't an intentional death or suicide, but it was a gang leader... actually I'll start from earlier. It was a Chinese movie where, in order to escape from a heist, the leader of the gang shot himself in the head to be taken to ER and organize his rescue from the hospital. I remember Baron what's his face licking that woman's face too, and his poor man's mind palace. If I recall, Sherlock shot him. It probably came as a great shock to him that his death wasn't more grandiose and befitting of his ego.
That was SUCH a satisfying death for a villain who I hated. I wish more characters would just plug the villain either when they're mid-speechifying/at their most confident. You know what I like? I like the idea of bruising a villain's ego by going for them first, assuming they're not alone of course. I mean, why dignify them with saving them for last? That's kind of an ego boost, isn't it? It probably wouldn't make for as good TV, but I like the idea of starting with the big bag first and working my way down to hired goon number 6. That's how I would insult them in the afterlife.
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Post by Chalice_Of_Evil on May 5, 2024 0:41:27 GMT 1
That was SUCH a satisfying death for a villain who I hated. I wish more characters would just plug the villain either when they're mid-speechifying/at their most confident. You know what I like? I like the idea of bruising a villain's ego by going for them first, assuming they're not alone of course. I mean, why dignify them with saving them for last? That's kind of an ego boost, isn't it? It probably wouldn't make for as good TV, but I like the idea of starting with the big bag first and working my way down to hired goon number 6. That's how I would insult them in the afterlife. I agree. Taking villains down a peg or two/humiliating them before their demise adds that extra insult to injury. This is slightly OT, but there was a death I loved in the series final of the Buffy the Vampire Slayer spin-off, Angel. **spoilers, obviously** A character who'd thought himself to be the arch-nemesis/greatest foe of the show's lead character was taken out by a "flunky" and he seemed so offended by this as he died. He'd thought he was of greater significance to the main hero than he actually was. I enjoyed the fact that the lead character thought of this bad guy as little more than a nuisance who needed to be taken care of, but didn't even deem the guy worthy of taking out himself. THAT'S the kind of villain death I enjoy, as so often villains who've done such heinous things are let off 'too easy' in my mind by simply offing them quickly. Why not kill their ego first, before physically killing them? It's extra delicious.
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